let me play a little bit of what he had to say regarding the fiscal cliff and the threat that looms. let me play it. >> when it comes to raising taxes on the wealthy, those making more than $250,000, if republicans do not agree to that, is the administration prepared to go over the fiscal cliff? >> absolutely. there's no prospect to an agreement that doesn't involve those rates going up on the top 2% of the wealthiest. >> so is it a bluff when the obama administration says they're willing to go off the cliff if a deal is not reached on rates? >> i don't think it's a bluff. if you look at the reality of what happens, all the leverage which i -- right now clearly the white house has. they get more leverage if we go over their cliff. you can argue that would not send a good message to the country, to the world. it would prove that we are dysfunctional and cannot govern, et cetera, et cetera. in terms of dealing with the policy problem, which is you have this massive and growing debt, you have to bring in more revenues. there's multiple ways to do it, but critical ways to raise rates on